Showing posts with label chrislam orange county register jim hinch rick warren kings way king's way muslims interfaith. Show all posts
Showing posts with label chrislam orange county register jim hinch rick warren kings way king's way muslims interfaith. Show all posts

Monday, March 5, 2012

Is King's Way an Interfaith Document or Not? You Be The Judge.

Posted by Christine Pack

On February 23, 2012, an article titled Rick Warren Builds Bridge to Muslims was published in the Orange County Register (Orange County, California). It went off like a bomb in the evangelical community. This article, written by staff writer Jim Hinch, reported that Rick Warren of Saddleback Church was working on an interfaith document (known as King's Way) aimed at healing "divisions between evangelical Christians and Muslims by partnering with Southern California mosques and proposing a set of theological principles that includes acknowledging that Christians and Muslims worship the same God." In the immediate ensuing dust-up, bloggers blogged, talk show hosts talked, and social media sites were abuzz with discussion. What did this mean? Was Rick Warren now embracing the heretical, but trendy, new movement known as Chrislam? Eight days later, Rick Warren finally addressed the issue by giving a very clear and unambiguous statement affirming his Trinitarian, his Christian beliefs, and stating unequivocally that Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God. (The entire article can be read here.)


But now the writer of the original article in the Orange County Register, Jim Hinch, has released a portion of the King's Way document. Is this an interfaith document that gives the impression that Muslims and Christians worship the same God? You be the judge:
1. The primary source for this story was a five-page document jointly drafted by Abraham Meulenberg, a Saddleback pastor in charge of interfaith outreach, and Jihad Turk, director of religious affairs at the Islamic Center of Southern California, a mosque in Los Angeles. The document was unveiled at a December, 2011 dinner at Saddleback Church attended by approximately 300 Saddleback members and members of Southern California’s Muslim community. At the dinner a Powerpoint presentation described the document, and the King’s Way outreach effort which inspired the document, as “a path to end the 1,400 years of misunderstanding between Muslims and Christians.” The document, which was given to me by a source for this story on condition it not be published in its entirety, outlines several areas of theological agreement between Christians and Muslims and commits members of both faiths to three goals: becoming friends; making peace; and sharing “the blessings of God with others.” Here is how the document describes the points of theological agreement: 
I. WHO: we believe in 
ONE GOD: 
1. God is one (Mark 12:29; Muhammed 47:19)
2. God is the Creator (Genesis 1:1; Al Shura 42:11)
3. God is different from the world (1 Timothy 6:16; An An’am 6:103)
4. God is Good
a. God loves (1 John 4:16; Al Buruj 85:14)
b. God is just (1 John 1:19, Romans 3:26; Hud 11:45)
c. God’s love encompasses God’s judgment (1 Peter 4:8; Al A’raf 7:156; Al Ghafir 40:7) 
The Register story based the phrases “same God” and “one God” on the phrasing in this document, which states that Christians and Muslims believe in one God. 
2. Rick Warren initially posted a comment to the article claiming that the article contained “multiple errors.” That comment was later deleted, I presume by Warren. After seeing that comment I reached out to Warren’s director of communications. On Monday, Feb. 27 a Saddleback representative called and told me that while the Register story was factually accurate, folks at Saddleback would prefer that the opening paragraph read “Muslims and Christians believe that God is one.” Following a discussion with a Register editor Saddleback decided to withdraw its request for a clarification. At no time has anyone at Saddleback said to me or to anyone else at the Register that the story contains factual inaccuracies. 
3. Warren states in his white paper that “no one even talked to me about that article!” I made numerous attempts to contact Warren, both by phone and by e-mail, before the story was published. I was eventually told by Warren’s director of communications that Warren was too busy with other projects to speak with me or to e-mail a response to the story’s main claims, which I had e-mailed to the communications director. Instead I was put in touch with Tom Holladay, an associate senior pastor at Saddleback. I ran all of the story’s claims by Holladay and he affirmed all of them, including the language of the King’s Way document and the fact that King’s Way was an effort to build bridges of friendship and cooperation, not an attempt to evangelize. During my conversation with Holladay I asked whether the King’s Way effort, including the December dinner and the theological document, was done with Rick Warren’s approval. “Of course it has his approval,” Holladay replied. It is neither fair nor accurate to claim that this story was published without attempting to solicit Rick Warren’s response. 
4. Warren claims in his white paper that it is “flat-out wrong” that either he or members of Saddleback have promised not to evangelize the Muslims they are working with in the King’s Way effort. As I stated above, that was not what I was told by Tom Holladay. Also, every one of the Muslim sources I talked to for this story emphasized that both sides promised not to evangelize one another. Indeed Muslims told me that the promise not to evangelize was one of the things that enabled them to overcome their wariness toward evangelicals and build bonds of friendship. Again, no source for this story, including at Saddleback, ever told me that the intent of the King’s Way effort was to evangelize Muslims.
This story, obviously, has generated a great deal of passionate response. I respect Rick Warren’s desire to make his views and intentions clear. However I do not believe it is fair to question the accuracy of the Register’s story or the way it was reported. I have had several conversations with people at Saddleback following the publication of the story, including with the church’s director of communications. Everyone I have talked to from the church has told me that the story is entirely factually accurate but they wish certain phrases had been worded differently. However, since those phrases stem directly from a printed document whose authenticity no one has questioned, everyone agrees that there is nothing in the story to correct.
(HT: Apprising Ministries

 Additional Resources 



Rick Warren Addresses Chrislam Controversy

Sunday, March 4, 2012

Rick Warren Addresses Chrislam Controversy

Posted by Christine Pack

Pastor Rick Warren, Saddleback Church
In the article Rick Warren Builds Bridge to Muslims, published 2/23/12 in the Orange County Register and written by staff writer Jim Hinch, it was reported that Rick Warren of Saddleback Church was working on an interfaith document aimed at healing "divisions between evangelical Christians and Muslims by partnering with Southern California mosques and proposing a set of theological principles that includes acknowledging that Christians and Muslims worship the same God."

Understandably, this article went off like a bomb inside the theological community. Bloggers blogged, talk show hosts talked, and social media sites were abuzz with discussion. What did this mean? Was Rick Warren now embracing the heretical, but trendy, new movement known as Chrislam? Eight days later, Rick Warren finally addressed the issue by giving a very clear and unambiguous statement affirming his Trinitarian, his Christian beliefs, and stating unequivocally that Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God. (The entire article can be read here.)

The problem with Rick Warren's supposed clarification is that if you hold his statement up against his life's actions, they don't seem to add up. Now that Rick Warren has come out with his statement, I think we must take the statement at face value, but I think we can certainly ask questions. In some ways, it's almost like he's gone under oath and given his testimony. But since he has, we can now present the following Exhibits:

 Exhibit A - Jim Hinch Did Attempt to Speak To Rick Warren 

Jim Hinch, the writer of the original Orange County article in question, despite what Rick Warren claims, DID try to speak directly with Rick Warren but was told he was unavailable for comment:
RICK WARREN: "Those statements were made by a reporter, not by me. I did not say them ... I do not believe them... I completely disagree with them ... and no one even talked to me about that article!"
JIM HINCH: "I talked to sources both at Saddleback and in the Muslim community and all of them described the mutual outreach efforts and the attempt to find points of theological common ground. While reporting the story I asked to speak to Rick Warren but was told he was too busy for an interview."
In addition to this, Jim Hinch, the writer of the article that caused such a dust-up is just a regular guy: he's not a theologian, and to the best of my understanding, he's not even a Christian. and after having assessed the data in front of him and after reading the King's Way document, came to the conclusion that it was an interfaith document. The question should not be, "Did Jim Hinch lie?" (because he didn't) but rather, it should be this: Why wasn't the Christian gospel message so profoundly clear in the King's Way document that it was abundantly clear to the secular, onlooking world (like Jim Hinch) that Muslims and Christians do not worship the same God?

(Note: Writer Jim Hinch has released a portion of the King's Way document, which can be read here.)

 Exhibit B - Presidential Inauguration 

This exhibit includes the Presidential Inauguration, where Rick Warren gave a carefully worded interfaith prayer in which he gave one of the names of Jesus as "Issa." This is NOT one of Jesus' names. "Issa" is the Arabic name for the Jesus of the Qu'ran, and the Jesus in the Qu'ran is not the Jesus of the Bible, but "another Jesus" (2 Cor 11:4) who is not the Divine Son of God, nor the Savior who came to make atonement for sinners.

 Exhibit C - Rick Warren Says It's His Desire To Work with Muslims, Jews...Not Evangelize Them 

Rick Warren has given on-the-record statements that he does not feel he needs to evangelize other faiths, but only wants to work together with them to better the community....

.....Jihad Turk, director of religious affairs at a mosque in California and also co-author of the King's Way document crafted by Saddleback Church, said of the agreed upon parameters for the interfaith document: "We agreed we wouldn't try to evangelize each other.......We'd witness to each other but it would be out of 'Love Thy Neighbor,' not focused on conversion."

....In 2006, Rick Warren gave an interfaith talk at a Jewish temple, before which he told the organizer of the event (Rabbi Wolfson) that his interest was in "helping all houses of worship, not in converting Jews."


 Additional Resources 



The Islamic Center of Southern California, Saddleback Church, and Our Friendship (by Jihad Turk of The Islamic Center of Southern California)

Thursday, March 1, 2012

Chrislam: When common ground becomes shaky ground

Posted by Christine Pack

Christian apologist and talk show host Chris Rosebrough (Fighting For The Faith) was recently the featured guest on Stand Up For The Truth radio show. From the Stand Up For The Truth website:
"We know that the God of the Bible is not the same god of the Qur’an. Yahweh of the Bible became flesh 2,000 years ago to be that perfect lamb, the Son, the atonement for our sins. The Jesus we believe in is God. But Allah of the Qur’an did not have a son. There was no atonement, no hope of a Messiah, and no grace for sinners.  The Christian God and the Muslim Allah cannot be one and the same. And yet there are a growing number of Christians and Muslims who are combining the faith–syncretizing the two into one. That’s called Chrislam, and it is heresy. 
This week the Orange County Register reported in an article that leadership of Pastor Rick Warren’s Saddleback Church believe that Muslims and Christians believe in the same God. Is the article accurate? Is that truly what these leaders believe? Our guest today has communicated with Rick Warren twice in the past few days, and it’s as close as anyone has gotten to America’s Pastor to hear in his own words what is going on. 
Chris Rosebrough is host of a daily two-hour internet radio program, Fighting For The Faith, heard around the world on Pirate Christian Radio, a broadcast group he started in his hometown of Indianapolis. Chris is at the forefront of those contending for the truth of God’s Word."
Listen to the show in its entirety here.


 Additional Resources 

Does Rick Warren Still Get Dr. John Piper's "Stamp of Approval?"

Rick Warren Acknowledges Christians and Muslims Worship Same God

A Common Word Between Us and You (Interfaith document created by the Muslim community, aimed at uniting Christians-Muslims)

A Christian Response to A Common Word Between Us and You (Interfaith document created by the Christian community, signed by Rick Warren)

Rick Warren Gets John Piper's Stamp of Approval?

Controversy Over An Article About Rick Warren's Efforts to Bring Muslims, Christians Together

Islamic Center of Southern California Co-authors Historic Interfaith Document ("King's Way")